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Jacob Kishere's avatar

Spent some hours with this expansive exposition this morning. I will be sitting with much of it and likely more to follow up in dialogue but I'd like to offer here notes on highlights that stood out for me:

First I'm sitting with the sense of Christian Atheism as a void space. The proposition that the proper ground for interfaith and intercultural dialogue is not in fact a general sense that we all vibe with spirit. But actually, a meeting in the void, an empty space. In the first Christianity Beyond Itself dialogue w/ Matthew I articulated how I'd come to see SENSESPACE (or what it points to) as a 'Vibrant and empty' space. One which is not aperspectival and modern, somehow full and empty. I wonder how this aligns and doesn't.

Second, I commend the articulation around the mystic experience vs metaphysical map. That overly imposing the map may actually make it so that children have to destroy the map to reach the direct experience. Or they mistake the map for the experience and destination. In both cases, inviting a parenting that shares mythos while holding ambiguity, that invites Christianity as a question and a mystery more than an answer.

Third, modern science and ethics without religion is 'Sons without Fathers' whilst a rejection of modernism and return to religion is 'Fathers without Sons'. Brilliant.

Fourth, Marx was working 'for the struggle of crucified workers to ressurrect in the holy spirit body of a workers commune'. Never read a clearer insight into the christian basis of marxism. I was curious that you described this articulation as being in 'christian atheist language'. Is 'Christian atheist language' that which affords reading christianity in things beyond itself, eg. Marx, psychoanalysis etc...?

Fifth, the holy spirit as a community is insufficient to the necessary creative destruction of communities. Zarathustra points to a way through that, an affirmation and a capacity to journey in and out of communities. A pilgrimage that occurs through communities that doesn't end in them. This is essential to our current predicament.

Sixth, Freud and the God-father. Fascinating to read this account of the murder of the father by the band. When he speaks of the 'spoils' of aggression and sexual enjoyment, is that to say these spoils were stored up in the father and are now unleashed for the son? Or that the son already held them but with the death of God he's now unbound and unleashed unto these pre-existing drives with nothing to contain them? Fascinating to sense into how the death of God can unleash jouissance and a society premised on continual positive fulfilment of desire. That this can never be ended until we see a turning towards the negative. To find the fulfilment in the nothing, void and emptiness.

Seven, the living christ vs the ideal. That a christ of the past is more subject to idealisation, purity that could lead to some avoidance of psychological stagnation. That the living, erotic, shadow-integrating christ is fully in the present, in the world, in the profane. This feels very Christianity Beyond Itself. Also points to the other key premise, that the living embodied Christ is also intrinsically a unique one, occupying and expressing through a vast variety of contexts.

Eight, Church of contradiction: the idea of a theatricaly staging of the death of God and a communion in the abyss afterwards feels potent and novel while also connecting with the Greek tragedy tradition. Love to explore this further.

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Commend the relative madness and devotion required to think all of this. To think Christianity through all of these thinkers from socio-economic, to psycho-sexual and so on. To think the contradiction.

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O.G. Rose's avatar

This was a profound, expansive, and critical work that should be read and shared widely. I recorded some thoughts here in honor of the course, though no pressure at all to give them a listen. Your talk with Ebert was also outstanding. Well done, Cadell! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TedDvzwLCr0)

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